tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5293155946761960913.post2984658341939297222..comments2024-03-19T10:41:35.976-05:00Comments on Bronze Age Babies: Iron Mike's Legion: Superboy and the Legion of Super-Heroes 219Doughttp://www.blogger.com/profile/04248324005584963229noreply@blogger.comBlogger14125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5293155946761960913.post-60197338277598788762019-03-14T12:47:04.042-05:002019-03-14T12:47:04.042-05:00I do love the Mike Grell artwork on the Legion (th...I do love the Mike Grell artwork on the Legion (though there’s the occasional odd panel maybe due to being rushed) though it’s a slight step down from Dave Cockrum, but still fantastic art.<br />Yeah, I like Colossal Boy putting the moves on Vi as soon as Duplicate Boy is incapacitated. By the way, I was glad to see that Duplicate Boy couldn’t absorb Validus’s power, as it was too much for him. I hate the power to absorb or mimic others’ powers, so it’s nice to at least see a limit there. <br />And the ending is really good. Sort of bittersweet. Love that there’s some ambiguity there. The Legionnaires might have cause to feel a little guilty, and yet, as Doug points out, the Fatal Five were stealing!<br /><br />I agree that it’s disappointing when you’ve got big teams battling and it’s all one on one battles. I suspect it’s just easier to write it that way like Karen says, and heck, maybe easier to draw it that way too. <br /><br />As far as Validus speaking, while it may have seemed odd, he did actually speak in his first appearance. Somehow that power of speech went away, but here he is speaking again, and it’s worth noting that the writer was Jim Shooter, the same guy who created him. I do like Validus as a childlike being who is only evil when controlled by Tharok (or some other evil person). And yes, Validus was some time in the 80’s retconned to have been Lightning Lad and Saturn Girl’s son, which I hate, so I tend to pretend it didn’t exist. Just like I tend to pretend Steve Englehart’s retconning of the Falcons origin to make him a pimp didn’t really happen. I can’t believe nobody ever retconned that terrible retcon!<br /><br />Of course, Tharok must be the uglies Fatal Fiver, though I don’t think I’ve ever seen Mano with his helmet off.<br /><br />By the way, Light Lass hits Mano with her handbag? That is sexist and embarrassing! And where did she get a handbag??<br /><br />And yeah, I don’t think Brainy is all that bad, generally speaking.<br />dbutler16https://www.blogger.com/profile/00046066729353639991noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5293155946761960913.post-5509806971699874782016-10-12T21:29:36.784-05:002016-10-12T21:29:36.784-05:00Glad to see this review and the sampled pages. I&#...Glad to see this review and the sampled pages. I'm a Curt Swan-Dave Cockrum- Jim Sherman fan<br />...Grell never appealed to me...his stuff looked crude and shaky next to Cockrum's. It IS early work, and he did get much better. Thanks for getting me to take a second look. Jim Shooter, when he's good, is one of the best writers in superhero comics, and the Grell art may grow on me.drivingovercanaanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07044638847400003359noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5293155946761960913.post-50534063390918970762016-10-12T19:03:08.564-05:002016-10-12T19:03:08.564-05:00The Legion and Teen Titans were some of my favorit...The Legion and Teen Titans were some of my favorite 70s DC. They were favorites but looking back they didnt run the whole decade. I remember being a fan of Mike Grell and when Superboy left, which i never understood. I agree it might have been style over substance, the Legion kinda combined sci fi and super heroes. A favorite Cockrum story was when the Xmen battled the imitation legion.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5293155946761960913.post-84923637916126604772016-10-11T15:44:58.757-05:002016-10-11T15:44:58.757-05:00I am a huge LOSH/Grell fan! I had this issue and m...I am a huge LOSH/Grell fan! I had this issue and must have worn it out from re-re-re-reading constantly! <br /><br />Mike Grell's artwork is fantastic, and a great fit for this mag. Grell's Validus is large, imposing, and not goofy-looking at all (sadly, he was often drawn pretty silly in the silver age). Mike also has a sense of humor, for example the micro-hotel that was mentioned above or in other instances when Mr Spock would be seen in crowd scenes. I loved that cutaway diagram of the legion cruiser!!! Still do, even if we question the dimensions, though I do not have as big an issue with it as you guys.<br /><br />The legion's costumes during this era were terrific (thank you Mr's Cockrum and Grell). I remain an unabashed fan of Cosmic Boy's Man-Corset! Also a fan of Colossal Boy's bare legs. Hey, in the 30th century we have total control over the weather so futuristic Metropolis is a balmy 76 degrees all of the time! Plus, it's only fair play: the girls costumes were skimpy so why not the boys? But I digress...<br /><br />Doug: Mentioning that Burt Reyolds pose sadly reminds me of Stan Lee's recreation of that same photo! Brr....<br /><br />Thanks for the trip down memory lane with one of my favorite comics of all time! I really enjoyed reliving it with you all.johnlindwallhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11742041159952441523noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5293155946761960913.post-56004366347286877982016-10-10T21:37:12.222-05:002016-10-10T21:37:12.222-05:00Wowee! A review of a comicbook I actually own! Yea...Wowee! A review of a comicbook I actually own! Yeah, this was a fun one all around - you had a great supervillain team, the Fatal Five, a love triangle between Duplicate Boy, Colossal Boy and Shrinking Violet, a dramatic element (the near death of Duplicate Boy),a cool fight to climax the story and a plot twist (the Five stealing all that stuff for leisure purposes).<br /><br />The Legion cruiser was cool, although it was obviously ripped off from the design of Star Trek's Enterprise ship. Wasn't Cockrum a Trekkie? As for who was (is?) the ugliest member of the Fatal Five, wasn't it Mano? :)<br /><br />I definitely second Karen's opinion that Grell brought a sense of sex appeal to the legion, something that Silver Age artists glossed over. Cosmic Boy outfit? Hey, as my fuzzy memory recalls, Shadow Lass and Princess Projectra certainly wore some risque outfits at that time!<br /><br /><br />- Mike 'looks like Bouncing Boy' from Trinidad & Tobago. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5293155946761960913.post-9067784095137999112016-10-10T15:30:42.727-05:002016-10-10T15:30:42.727-05:00Thanks for jumping in on this somewhat rare DC duo...Thanks for jumping in on this somewhat rare DC duo-review today. It was a lot of fun to get back in the saddle for a partner review, especially on the Legion. I have to offer a mea culpa here -while battling with Blogger to get the art in, I somehow dropped Doug's first comment in the 'Good' section after my first two remarks -it should have been in-between them. I think it still read OK but -dang it, Blogger!<br /><br />Edo, yes, there is a rather hilarious panel with Shrinking Violet and Duplicate Boy flying away at speck-size from a tabletop hotel INSIDE a regular sized building with a sign that reads 'hotel.' I can only think that Grell intended this to be funny.<br /><br />Terry, I would agree that the Cockrum and Grell era issues are attractive primarily for the art and not the stories. being primarily a Marvel reader I was expecting much more in terms of characterization, and of course plot, and these just didn't deliver. When Paul Levitz came on the scene, that all changed -wow, did it change! But the early 70s were more about style over substance. I think the stories I made up in my head about the Legion were more entertaining. As Doug said, only a few characters really seemed to have defined traits, and there were just so dang many of them, I suppose you'd need a score card or something as a writer to figure it out. That's one reason Wildfire was refreshing -he might have been a jerk, but he was different!<br /><br />Osvaldo's observation certainly is astute -besides being action-packed, Grell also brought sex appeal to the Legion, which was something that certainly had been bubbling under the surface for years. All those teenagers, hanging out together in their clubhouse -it doesn't take much of an imagination to understand at least part of the Legion's appeal. When Grell (and Cockrum before him) showed up, that appeal became more obvious, and we started seeing much more skin -even on the guys! Annnnd -queue the Cosmic Boy outfit!Karenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17032477453891087135noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5293155946761960913.post-88253918090634862082016-10-10T14:35:50.364-05:002016-10-10T14:35:50.364-05:00Thanks for the kind words, everyone.
Edo, I'v...Thanks for the kind words, everyone.<br /><br />Edo, I've put the book away, but I am 99% certain that the scene you brought up indeed happens in this issue.<br /><br />Osvaldo left a funny comment on Twitter about the scene where Superboy lay in repose. If you've seen the Burt Reynolds photos from that skin magazine for ladies, you know where his comment went.<br /><br />We'll have more Legion coming your way in two weeks. Karen and I are going to review a story with James Sherman on the art chores -- the debut of Dawnstar. Stay tuned.<br /><br />DougDoughttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04248324005584963229noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5293155946761960913.post-64819103086094993602016-10-10T13:28:54.191-05:002016-10-10T13:28:54.191-05:00I love these Legion stories; Grell is a great arti...I love these Legion stories; Grell is a great artist (and a pretty good writer too...it would've been interesting to see him write some Legion tales).<br /><br />Mike WilsonAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5293155946761960913.post-83740210128520692032016-10-10T09:51:12.528-05:002016-10-10T09:51:12.528-05:00As I've said before I've never read LOSH b...As I've said before I've never read LOSH but this looks really good. The Fatal Five look and sound challenging. I was definitely a Marvel guy, but the fact is I never saw this title on any of the spinner racks I shopped. I didn't know it even existed until much later in life. Which raises a question - did store proprietors actually pick what went on their comic racks, or was it just a random grab bag? How did that work? I cannot picture the elderly gentleman who ran the local drugstore picking off of a checklist. Just curious, because like I said some titles just never appeared. <br /><br />Great review though. It looks very good.Martinex1noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5293155946761960913.post-72495252873374070972016-10-10T08:46:38.747-05:002016-10-10T08:46:38.747-05:00Nice review, Karen and Doug! Always enjoy a visit ...Nice review, Karen and Doug! Always enjoy a visit with the Legion. Even in the Silver Age, their stories seemed more engaging (more Marvel-like?) than many other DC titles. Perhaps much of the reason for that lies with Jim Shooter's writing...<br /><br />Have never read this issue, but it looks quite enjoyable. Great artwork, as you noted (most of my Legion reading involved Staton and Giffen, coming later)- plus a Fatal Five appearance! I'll join Richard in planning some more DC reading in the future...Redartzhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08221459636234713619noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5293155946761960913.post-1372424863201736382016-10-10T08:34:03.714-05:002016-10-10T08:34:03.714-05:00By the way, Karen & Doug, since you've bot...By the way, Karen & Doug, since you've both read this recently, tell me if I'm remembering something correctly: was there a scene right at the beginning of the story in which Shrinking Violet and Duplicate Boy are staying in a tiny hotel that's actually on a table inside a normal-sized building?Edo Bosnarnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5293155946761960913.post-49363355385023075042016-10-10T07:55:38.895-05:002016-10-10T07:55:38.895-05:00I'll be reading this one soon since I just bou...I'll be reading this one soon since I just bought it at Annapolis Comic Con a couple of weeks ago. I've been building a collection of the Cockrum/Grell runs on Superboy and Legion for about a year. For some reason I never bought a lot of these when they were new.<br /><br />I always had mixed feelings about Legion. Great concept, cool costumes, even in the 1960s. But the stories were often so WHITEBREAD, as if they were written for the Comics Code Authority (or our parents). None of the drama you'd find in X-Men, FF, Avengers, or any other Marvel title. Everyone was a clean-cut, bland, nice-guy/nice girl. Probably drank milk with their cookies and thought they were partying hard.<br /><br />Then Cockrum and Grell come along. Wow. Grell was still pretty new, and his proportions were often distorted, sort of like a poor imitation of Gil Kane. But he definitely showed potential and soon became one of the best artists at DC in the mid 1970s.<br /><br />When Jim Shooter took over the writing from Cary Bates (starting with #209), things definitely improved. (For the record, Cary Bates is one of my least favorite comic book writers of all time). But so far (I've read #197 through 213), it's still the artwork that is the main appeal here. So I take my Legion as a light entertainment, enjoying the art but not taking the storytelling too seriously. There were better plots and characterizations over at Marvel in the mid-1970s. But yeah, I just can't resist that Mike Grell art.<br /><br />As for Jim Shooter, even some of his mid-1960s Legion tales were pretty decent (by DC standards, anyway).<br /><br />Terry in VirginiaAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5293155946761960913.post-70638930144525380382016-10-10T07:48:53.750-05:002016-10-10T07:48:53.750-05:00My first ever issue of Superboy and the Legion. Do...My first ever issue of Superboy and the Legion. Doug, you're right about that spotty distribution - in my parts the Legion was often pretty hard to come by for some reason, and I recall that the first largely unbroken run of issues I had were when Joe Staton was doing most of the art (and a lot of those were from those bagged 3-packs with the Whitman logo on them).<br />Anyway, I don't recall many of the details from the story, but I do remember loving the art, and some of those panels you posted really pluck at my nostalgia strings. So thanks for the great review of this one (even if Karen cheated :P).<br /><br />As for the Starship Legionprise, erm, the Legion Cruiser, yeah, the scale is really odd as depicted; can't believe all that stuff listed can fit into that little corridor section. However, I like the "human needs" label for what I am assuming is the space-loo.Edo Bosnarnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5293155946761960913.post-19350467442140450052016-10-10T07:48:40.941-05:002016-10-10T07:48:40.941-05:00That artwork is great (sort of like Adams inked by...That artwork is great (sort of like Adams inked by Byrne, though not as good as either). I always thought DC skimped on the backgrounds compared to Marvel. I often wondered as a child if the reason that DC took place nowhere real (Metropolis, Gotham, Central City) was because you’d have to draw some real landmarks once in a while if you were in NY or LA. <br /><br />My loyalty to Marvel (at least Silver & Bronze) remains unshakeable, but I have to acknowledge that I have read a lot of bad Marvel comics and missed a lot of good DC ones. Especially when I see stuff like this. I also kind of enjoy the DC movies in a different way to Marvel because I have no idea of the backstory and nothing invested in it. Directors can trample all over the comics and I have no idea. <br /><br />Retirement project: read some DC. <br /><br />Richard<br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com