The Splash Page Made Me Buy the Comic!

Martinex1:  We have frequently discussed covers that have made us buy a book, and there are indeed numerous examples of the great and colorful cover art that caught my eye from across a room.   But today let's talk about some of the splash pages that captured my attention.

As a kid purchasing comics in the late '70s on a very limited allowance, I typically circled a spinner rack numerous times as I considered all of the options for my precious fifty cents or dollar.   Sometimes even my favorite titles didn't totally draw me in and had to compete against all of the other four-color choices.  It wasn't always a slam dunk that I would buy Avengers, Fantastic Four, or the Amazing Spider-Man.  Sometimes the store proprietor wouldn't want me to flip through the book's pages but when given the chance I definitely took a peek to get a glimpse of the story.  And often it was the splash and not the cover that sealed the deal.  Here are a few examples of those experiences from my early collecting days:

One of the very first comic books I purchased was Avengers #164, the start of the Count Nefaria conflict, so it would seem natural that I would grab issue #165 as soon as it hit the rack.   But that wasn't the case at all.  I have to admit that today when I look at the George Perez art for that cover I admire it, but when I was nine-years old it did not grab me.   I can clearly remember thinking how small the team members were on the cover.  And I did not like the floating red Nefaria head screaming at them.  And on top of it, the white logo and lower right corners were a bit mottled from the printing.  Where was the hand-to-hand combat that I was expecting?  Where was the epic battle following the closing moments of #164 when Nefaria absorbed the strength of Power Man, the speed of Whirlwind, and the energy of Living Laser?  But once I opened the book, the John Byrne splash page answered all of my questions!  Nefaria just decked Captain America and Black Panther easily and he is totally unscathed; the villain is just standing there gloating.  This is going to be a huge fight; he's going to kill them all!  At least that is how I interpreted it in my youth.   As it turned out, I am glad I saw the splash page and snatched that issue up because the Count Nefaria storyline has remained my all-time favorite.  Looking back at the art, it may not have been Byrne's best but I loved it.  Here is the cover and splash of which I speak:

 

That very same month, August of 1977, nearly the same thing happened to me with the Fantastic Four.   However, this had a bit of a twist.  I had previously read the Len Wein penned and George Perez penciled FF issue #187.   I was mesmerized by the team's battle with Klaw and the Molecule Man.  That book had so much great art and suspense that I just could not put it down.  The last page overwhelmed young me.  It was monumental and shocking when down-on-his-luck Reed Richards picked up the mystical rod and transformed into the Molecule Man himself!  I know that I stared at that page for a long time.  Reed looked so creepy.   I looked at his jagged lips and his treacherous scowl and I just had to have the next issue.   What a great cliffhanger!

But when the next issue showed up at our local pharmacy, I was seriously underwhelmed by the cover.   "Seriosuly!  They are fighting a giant walking building!  How dumb!" young me thought at the time, "It looks like a silly cartoon not a dangerous battle. It is not scary at all."   In retrospect, it reminded me of one of those Twinkie advertisements we talked about a couple of days ago.  And again, the white background did not help.  It was a struggle to buy that book; it really was.  What carried me through was the memory of the closing splash of #187.   That crazy Reed in the green costume stuck in my head; so the previous issue's final splash made me buy issue #188.  Here they are for your viewing pleasure:

 

Hey!  Wait a minute!  That is bizarre!

The final example for today's post is Marvel Team-Up issue #70 that was on sale in March of 1978.  It had a perfectly fine cover and in fact I liked the cover a lot.   It was dynamic and cinematic.  I just wasn't particularly a Thor fan at the time so I wasn't convinced.  But when I flipped it open, the John Byrne art took my breath away.  I had seen giants numerous times in comics before, but this one looked monstrous crashing through the building, scaring the citizens, and getting ready to put a squeeze on the tiny Spider-Man in his right hand.  I had to have it!  Looking at it now, the inking is a little overdone for my taste.  It still packs a wallop, but I cannot take my eyes off the citizen in the foreground who looks like a zombie.   When I was young, I could only focus on the size of the Living Monolith.   Take a gander.

So there you have it - three splash pages that captured my cash. I cannot explain what hit me on such a visceral level, but it was definitely the interior art that I so clearly remember doing so.  What do you think?  Do you have any examples that you would like to share?   Cheers all!

Discuss: Facially Hirsute Heroes and Villains

Yes, even Doug was a facially hirsute hero, back on his wedding day in 1988! 
All comments and insults are certainly welcome, and deserved!

BAB Classic: Born Only to Die?

X-Men #95 (October 1975)
"Warhunt!"
Chris Claremont-Dave Cockrum/Sam Grainger

NOTE:  This post was originally published in March 2010.

Doug: Welcome back to the conclusion of our look at the first "regular" (albeit bi-monthly) adventure of the All-New, All-Different X-Men. When last we saw our favorite mutants, they'd been blasted out of the Blackbird by the missiles of Count Nefaria - recent appropriator of the weapons of Valhalla Mountain. If the team makes it safely down, they'll have to contend with a doomsday clock Nefaria has set, threatening to unleash the entire USA missile inventory. It's certainly a precarious situation as we join the X-Men in mid-fall!

Doug: In the midst of the freefall, Cyke barks out orders to Storm and Banshee to grab X-Men and carry them down. An interesting nugget is revealed about Nightcrawler as Cyclops orders him to teleport himself to safety. We learn that Nightcrawler must exit at the same velocity he enters, so in effect he'd go "splat" no matter what -- I have to wonder... was this a Claremont idea, or did it come from Dave Cockrum, Nightcrawler's creator?

Karen: I definitely think the Nightcrawler 'physics lesson' was a Claremont bit - the guy is a science fiction buff and science geek. But does it make any sense to you that Nightcrawler, a guy probably with no formal education at all, would be spouting stuff about the the Law of Conservation of Energy? Why not just say, "When I teleport, I retain the speed I started with" or something like that? It just felt out of character.

Doug: I agree. It was almost like someone else had told him the explanation at some point. You're probably spot on about his education, as it's my impression that Nightcrawler never mutated -- he was born with those elfish looks.

Doug: We see some bitterness (mid-air bickering is great, isn't it?) directed from Colossus toward Wolverine, and Colossus tells that he can get down on his own. His is certainly the best landing. Eventually all mutants make it back to terra firma and are accounted for. Thunderbird wastes no time in getting under Cyclops' skin, referring again to him as "One-Eye". I'll say again that Claremont had his finger on the pulse of this team in the same manner that Stan and Jack had the Fantastic Four all those years ago. Nightcrawler is ordered to teleport inside the mountain, and does so.

Karen: In these early issues, Colossus certainly seemed very self-assured. How could he know he would survive such a fall? Were they trying to show his bravery, or even a little cockiness?

Doug: One could argue that the Soviet government had tested his limits -- after all, if Piotr's brother was a cosmonaut, they would have known about him. But then, that doesn't make sense, because when Xavier came to ask him for his assistance, the word "defection" was never used. Curious...

Doug: Once inside the mountain, Nightcrawler is engaged by Frog-Man of Nefaria's Ani-Men and promptly insults him by referring to him as Herr Frosch. A simple teleport to the rear, a solid shot to the jaw, and Nightcrawler was on his way again. Triggering a door in the mountainside, Kurt is reunited with the team. Entering the mountain, however, proves dangerous as Nefaria attacks the X-Men first with gas, then with entranced Air Force troops.

Karen: Nightcrawler's easy defeat of Frog-Man is pretty much what I would expect for all the Ani-Men. They are completely out-classed. But this is only the third outing for the team, so we'll roll with it. We get a very good example of how powerful Storm is when she creates a flood in the base (!) to wash away all those hypnotized troops. I love the expression Cockrum drew on her face - amused and pleased with herself. Behind her, it's obvious that Cyclops is realizing that these new X-Men of his are a big change from his old buddies.

Doug: I thought Cockrum's art was better in this issue than last, perhaps because of the inks of Sam Grainger (Grainger had done a bang-up job over Sal Buscema in Avengers in the late 1960's). It still wasn't as good as I'd seen of Cockrum in other stories (later X-Men, Legion, and his short but fine run on the Avengers), but it was better than #94.

Doug: Shortly after Storm disperses the soldiers, the Ani-Men attack en masse. It's a good chance to again showcase the abilities of the team, and the Ani-Men match up well in terms of powers. The X-Men prove victorious when they switch off their natural enemies, and do some cross-butt-kicking (with a little teamwork thrown in here and there). Once the dust settles, it's apparent that Banshee and Thunderbird are going to have to sit out the next step, as they were knocked out by Gort the Gorillaman. So it's off to find the Count!

Karen: "Gort" - you know those guys had seen The Day the Earth Stood Still! But I love a good gorilla. Nefaria is such a wimp here, really doing next to nothing in the story; but I guess that's what masterminds do -they leave the dirty work for their henchmen.

Doug: And don't think Nefaria didn't know they were coming! Nefaria makes it into a Marine Harrier and takes off. Banshee and Thunderbird, freshly awakened, pursue and Thunderbird leaps onto the plane as it roars out of the hangar. Banshee takes to the air, screaming at John Proudstar to let go and let Banshee catch him. Thunderbird refuses, and pounds the cockpit in an attempt to get at Nefaria. Meanwhile, the other X-Men have reached the control room and attempt to disable Nefaria's countdown to missile release. Suddenly, Professor Xavier psychically contacts Cyclops to inform him that the battle with the Ani-Men had destroyed the launch capability. He also tells the team to get out to assist Banshee.

Karen: Yeah, you know things are not going to turn out well.

Doug: Finally bursting through the cockpit, Thunderbird bashes the controls until the jet begins to spiral out of control. As Xavier confronts him in an effort to implore him to get off the plane, Thunderbird defiantly continues his assault. Soon the jet explodes, apparently killing both Proudstar and Nefaria. On the ground a horrified Banshee tells Cyclops how he begged Thunderbird to get off, but he would not. A single red feather clings to the wreckage, now strewn across a ravine. 

Doug: I felt the ending of this story was a little rushed. The build-up was done well, and an appropriate amount of time was given to the jet scene to enhance the drama. However, I thought that finishing the scene with three panels where Cyclops is quite callous toward the death of a teammate, and then the team apparently turning to just walk off into the sunset, was not only in poor taste but seemingly done without much emotion. To be blunt, it was a real downer on top of a real downer -- and I felt that way even when I first read this as a 9-year old.Karen: Due to the vagaries of the comics distribution system back then, I didn't actually get to read this issue until many years later. All I knew was I opened up issue 96 and Thunderbird was dead. Whaaat??? Although he'd only been around a couple of issues, I really liked the character, in part because my grandmother was Sac and Fox Indian and I'd never seen an Indian superhero before, so it seemed really cool. But to find out he was dead...it was a big time bummer.

Karen: But I did eventually read the story itself, and it still left me cold. Sure, the guy had feelings of inadequacy, and he was a troubled Viet Nam vet, but why kill himself? It was only when I began to read interviews with Claremont and Cockrum that I learned the truth: Thunderbird was killed because he was redundant. I pulled out my copy of The X-Men Companion volume 1, and in the Dave Cockrum interview, when asked about Thunderbird's death, he had this to say:"We didn't know what to do with Thunderbird because we never thought him out. It was easier to kill him off than think him out." When asked about if he was too similar to Wolverine, Cockrum responded, "He duplicated both Wolverine (and Colossus)...Almost everybody in the group did something he did, and he seemed kind of superfluous." The shock value of killing off a character so early in the book was also mentioned as a factor. This I think owes a large part to what Gerry Conway did with killing Gwen Stacy. Remember, Gwen's death had only occurred a couple of years prior, and was considered shocking at the time. After that, it seemed like everybody was killing off characters.

Doug: This was my first issue of X-Men, and to be honest I can't remember if I'd seen Amazing Spider-Man #'s 121-122 at this point. Regardless, the death was indeed shocking to me. I wonder if they'd chosen to make Thunderbird the champion of mutant civil rights, how he'd have grown. Obviously the backstory of the history of Native Americans would have tied in nicely, as would his deep mistrust of the federal government. I did think that the epilogue to this in X-Men 96 was good, and somewhat of a tribute to Thunderbird's loss. Perhaps we'll get to that issue someday.

Karen: That's an interesting thought. I had a different idea: what if Thunderbird had just quit the team in issue 95, when he got in the fight with Cyclops, and years later he wound up being recruited by Magneto? I think it would have opened some intriguing story possibilities -former ally turned enemy and that sort of thing. He certainly had enough anger in him to "go to the dark side". Now his younger brother is running around in the X-Men black ops group, X-Force, as Warpath. I haven't seen much of him but his look is reminiscent of his brother's.

BAB Classic: X-Men, Ani-Men, and... Count Nefaria!

X-Men #94 (August 1975)
"The Doomsmith Scenario!"
Chris Claremont-Dave Cockrum/Bob McLeod

NOTE:  This post was originally published in March 2010.

Doug: OK, so you probably think we have some fixation with Maggia dude Count Nefaria. Well, no -- it just so happens that while Karen and I were discussing which arcs to analyze, the 3-part Avengers tale we just finished was on the list; shortly thereafter I was reading X-Men 94-95 and said "Why not?" She went along with it, so here we are!

Karen: This issue really brings back some memories. I had already read Giant-Size X-Men #1, so when I saw that these new characters were getting a regular title, I was excited. The only X-Men I had really known were the old team from the reprints that directly preceded the new team. This "all new, all different" group was -and still is- my X-Men team.

Doug: This is a fine issue, and a great follow-up to that classic Giant-Size X-Men #1. Chris Claremont takes over scripting from Len Wein, who serves as this book's editor (and receives a plot credit). The story begins with a gathering in Westchester, NY at Xavier's School for Gifted Youngsters. Professor Xavier wants to take inventory on the glut of X-Men now in his service. However, it's apparent right from the start that not everyone is feeling so chummy. Sunfire is the first to make an ass of himself, telling Prof. X and the X-Men to kiss off in no uncertain terms. Good riddance!, I say... Next, Banshee tries to get out of any commitment, but Xavier immediately twists his arm to stay. But it's what the Angel says next that creates the greatest uproar.

Doug: Warren steps forward to tell Xavier that the original team is leaving. It's a touching scene as Jean explains that when they came to the School, they were children with no control of their abilities, but under Xavier's tutelage they'd been molded into young men and women confident in who they were and what they could do. There's a nice couple of panels where Wolverine tells them to spare him the soap opera and Bobby takes exception. Good stuff -- really takes us back to Stan and Jack's FF of the early 1960's with the constant in-fighting.
Karen: Yes, I feel the same way. This was a good way to usher in the new era. While I am sure some of the older readers may have been annoyed to see their favorites leave, this passing of the torch seemed like a logical step. Of course now, the X-Men are more of a tribe than a school, so no one ever leaves. But back then, it made sense. The only thing that was hard to swallow was Jean leaving, but of course, she came back soon.

Doug: The next three pages are strong, showing Cyclops molding the six new X-Men into a team via relentless practice in the Danger Room. Text on these pages tells how Scott is driving them hard, seeking to mold this older team of loners, heroes used to being on their own, into a team. Claremont really hits some high notes on characterization, and we begin to see the characters that will grow over the next several years, even and especially after Dave Cockrum left the book.

Karen: I like that full page montage with Cycylops' head in the center.

Doug: And I'd like to comment on Cockrum's art here. While the pictures are unmistakeably his, Bob McLeod's inks seem at times to overpower the pencils. As we move into #95, see if you can pick up the differences in Sam Grainger's inks, which in my opinion give off more of a classic Cockrum look.

Karen: I'm torn on the artwork. I like both Grainger and McLeod. The styles are fairly different, with McLeod favoring much finer line work than Grainger. All in all I guess I would give a slight edge to Grainger, mostly because I see more of Cockrum in the art (as you say Doug).

Doug: Cut to Chapter Two, set inside the NORAD command center on Valhalla Mountain. An unwitting tech pushes a button on a gizmo he assumes is a prank from his co-workers and teleports the Ani-Men into the base. The Ani-Men had been seen in Marvel Comics off and on over the previous decade, usually in Daredevil. Here they are the henchmen for Maggia boss Count Nefaria. Of course the Ani-Men make short work of the outclassed soldiers. Nefaria shows up, takes the place over, and then announces to the world that he is holding the base ransom. There's a nice scene when the Beast is on the monitor talking to the Professor -- he tells that the Avengers cannot handle this crisis so it will have to be the X-Men.

Karen: I'd never seen the Ani-Men before (I didn't read much Daredevil) and at the time, as a ten year old, I thought they were cool. Now though, I just look at them and shake my head. These clowns were fighting the X-Men? Imagine if they'd brought the Ani-Men back say two years later. It would have been seen as a joke. Storm all by her lonesome probably could have handled these C-listers.

Doug: Yeah, no doubt. I guess the main attraction was that they'd somewhat match up with the X-Men's powers. I guess...

Karen: Besides the scene with the Beast, I also enjoyed the scene between Cyclops and Nightcrawler, where they discuss an accident in the Danger Room that injured Thunderbird. Cyclops is doing what he does -brood about it. Here we see why Cyclops was -at one time -considered one of the best team leaders in the Marvel Universe. When Nightrawler asks him how he's doing afterwards, he says, "We were both careless, Kurt, except that I was responsible and Thunderbird ended up taking all the lumps." This guy was always thinking about his team, and that earlier scene where he is driving them hard in training ties into this - he wanted them to be able to take care of themselves. Claremont really got that, at least in these early issues.


Doug: As the X-Men swoop toward the mountain, Nefaria acts by firing missiles at the Blackbird. Our story ends with a whole bunch of ejected mutants and a lot of sky between themselves and the ground!

Karen: A typical goofy comics ploy occurs here, where after the missiles have blasted the Blackbird, the X-Men eject in a lifting body, and Nefaria blasts them with a disintegrator - which only destroys the ship and not the people inside! Oh come on! But what a suspenseful ending!

Avengers 166 - Uru & Diamond!

Avengers 166 (December 1977)
"Day of the Godslayer!"
writer: Jim Shooter
pencils: John Byrne
inks: Pablo Marcos

Karen: OK folks, are you ready for the thrilling conclusion of this superb Avengers story?

Doug: I know I am! And how about that cover? Perez is of course the gold standard for the Avengers in the Bronze Age, but how 'bout Ernie Chan's (Chua's) inks on this cover? While I sometimes thought he overpowered John Buscema on the Conans on which they collaborated, his inks here provide some real depth to the illustration. Not to mention the fact that we've watched Nefaria just bulldoze the team -- but apparently not here, as two of the heavy-hitters are now on the scene!

Karen: We start right in the middle of the action, as Thor appears out of nowhere to take on the super-powered Count Nefaria! At first it would appear that the Thunder God has the situation in hand, but as Nefaria begins to realize that he's taken Thor's best and is still standing, he gains confidence. He then repeats himself, and drops a building on Thor! This doesn't stop Goldilocks and the two continue to go at it. Shooter and Byrne do a good job in showing Thor in all his glory and power - which makes Nefaria seem even more impressive.

Doug: I liked this splash page's flip-flop perspective to the ending panel from #165. Whereas before we got to see the Thunder God's anger, here we see the look of "Oh, crap..." on Nefaria's face. Thor's soliloquy about the Avengers being mere mortals, I am Thor!, yada yada yada, reminded me of the exchange he and Moondragon had had some issues previously -- when she was telling him that he was too good for the Avengers; in effect, attempting to compare herself to Thor, as she certainly felt that she was too good for the Avengers. Thor is letting Nefaria know in no uncertain terms that the varsity has arrived!
Karen: As the battle rages, Pym finds a way to revive the Vision, who attacks Nefaria and discovers his powers of intangibility do not work against him. I liked that panel of the Vision on the ground, about half-phased through the sidewalk!

Doug: One of the best lines ever: Beast - "Careful, Vish! He's dangerous!" Vision - "As am I"

Doug: I, too, liked that panel. Pretty wild that Nefaria could punch the Vision while he was intangible.
Karen: Professor Sturdy, the German scientist who helped Nefaria become a super-man, arrives on the scene and tells Nefaria that he is aging at an accelerated rate, and will die in two days time. This drives Nefaria over the edge, and he jumps off in a rage. Meanwhile, the Avengers try to re-group. One of my favorite scenes in this whole storyline occurs here, as an injured Captain America hands his invincible shield to Wonder Man, telling him to take it for protection against Nefaria's laser vision. A clearly stunned Wondy says, "It's an honor I don't feel I deserve! I - I don't know what to say, Cap...I....Thanks!"

Doug: To a degree, Perez would repeat that scene in the Avengers/JLA crossover, with Superman the beneficiary.
Karen: As Nefaria continues to rampage, jumping and blasting buildings, the Vision realizes that he cannot fly and so, if his momentum is halted, he has to fall. He brings the Count down and the other Avengers move in to take him on. This time, they act as a team, much more successfully. Still, although they stagger Nefaria, they don't bring him down. There's a terrific shot here of Thor punching the heck out of Nefaria!

Doug: You know, with all the junk that's being passed off as "The Avengers" these days, it's refreshing to read a story with a truly classic line-up. Thor, Iron Man, Cap, Vision, Wanda, Wonder Man, Beast, Black Panther, YJ, and the Wasp -- ten of the all-time greats. It would be interesting to see if the real Superman, and not a juiced-up Nefaria, could have held out so long against this sort of firepower.

Karen: The Vision comes up with his own personal solution: he increases his mass and density to their most extreme and drops like a bomb on Nefaria! This finally put the Count down for the count, so to speak.

Doug: This era was a high-point for the Vision in terms of storylines, characterization, and general facetime in the magazine. The scene you allude to is a real showcase for his "density as hard as a diamond" power. This big save, coming only months after his quite aggressive battle against Wonder Man in Avengers #158, cemented the Vision as a superstar among superstars.
Karen: On the final page, as Cap and Iron Man bicker over how the team has been performing, we find out that Sturdy's comments to Nefaria were a ruse: his rapid aging was a temporary side-effect; in reality, his super-energized cells had made him immortal!

Karen: I read this when it first hit the stands and I loved it then. It hasn't lost a thing in 33 years! It's a rousing battle with lots of great characterization, and great art. I highly recommend getting these books.

Doug: It's a very neatly-packaged story. There are the small subplots of Gyrich (who we don't know yet) and the old man on the steamer coming to America to meet his "children" -- who look an awful lot like Wanda and Pietro. But other than that, this is just good ol' fashioned superheroing, in the Mighty Marvel Manner!!

Avengers 165 - When Superman Comes a'Calling

Avengers 165 (November 1977)
"Hammer of Vengeance!"
Writer: Jim Shooter
Penciller: John Byrne
Inker: Pablo Marcos

Karen: Here in the second part of our three-part story, the Avengers are face-to-face with a tremendously powerful Count Nefaria, who has decided to kill them apparently just to prove he can. He pretty much toys with them, finally dropping a building on top of them! They are rescued by Iron Man, regroup and attack again, but have little success. When all looks lost though, who should appear but - the God of Thunder!

Doug: And as Captain America and others will point out in our next issue, Thor's popping in like he's the cavalry is getting stale. Not that the Avengers mind having their bacon saved, but where is the Thunder God in the more mundane tasks? The day-to-day crises?

Karen: Yes, it would be a little while before the reason for that was revealed.

Doug: I felt the opening sequence was really strong in terms of Byrne's storytelling. It's obvious that he "gets" the Avengers, their powers, and the interplay between their abilities and Nefaria's newfound powers works. In effect, each of the Avengers strikes solo, giving Byrne a chance to show us just what Nefaria can do.

Doug: I also thought it was nice to toss in the line from the Beast about Nefaria's role in the demise of Thunderbird back in X-Men #95; as we've just finished an examination of continuity here on the BAB blog, this is an example of the tangled web that was the Marvel Universe in days gone by.

Karen: Yes, a perfectly appropriate reference for the Beast to make. This issue is another fine example of how a story that is basically one long fight after another can incorporate plenty of characterization. We see the rift growing between Captain America and Iron Man - Cap thinks the Golden Avenger is taking his job as leader too lightly; we see Wonder Man battling against his own fears; and, the much-despised Henry Gyrich makes his first appearance.

Doug: And when discussing characterization, let's not forget Jarvis. He has a nice moment in the scene right after Nefaria knocks Wonder Man back into the mansion. And Gyrich was such a scum!

Karen: Nefaria really is very Superman-like here - except for not being able to fly, although he can "leap tall buildings in a single bound"!! Nefaria's heat vision looks devastating.
Doug: Yep -- again, to the first few pages: super strength, heat vision, super speed, invulnerability, super reflexes... The bad version of Kal-el, if you ask me. I thought it was cool, yet curious, in the scene you mentioned earlier where Nefaria dumps a building on our heroes. In the panels just prior, he attempts to mangle Cap's shield and can't even dent it. In my mind, I had a tough time juxtaposing that idea with the fact that he could lift a building weighing hundreds of tons. And about that building... defies logic that Nefaria could pick it up clean. You don't think there'd be pipes, etc. all over, an exposed foundation? I'm no architect, but I'm just saying...

Karen: Yes, ripping the building out of the ground seems over the top, and unrealistic -even for a comic! Funny too because a few years later Byrne re-visits this scene in Fantastic Four, this time using Gladiator, and implies that he does it through a form of telekinesis. But there's no implication of that there.

Karen: We get some foreshadowing that the Vision, who lies comatose in a stasis cylinder, will come into play before the story's over.
Doug: Karen, we long ago discussed the Vision's humanity or lack thereof. A scene like this just solidifies my point of view back then that he's more machine than man. But I don't want to dredge up old arguments!

Karen:Oh boy, let's not go through that again! To me, it was no different than seeing a person comatose on a hospital bed, attached to machines keeping them alive. But Vizh will get his turn next time. Even the Whizzer gets a good scene, reminding Nefaria that he is only mortal, and his reign will come to an end in 20 years or so.
Doug: I really appreciated Bob Frank's wilfulness to jump in and help. I thought this was a nice time in Avengers history when he'd come back. I was a little sad when the "true origin" of Wanda and Pietro played out a short time after this.

Karen: I know; on some level I liked the idea of Wanda and Pietro being the second generation of super-heroes, children of the World War II vets. Byrne's art really gets across the raw power of being thrown around, although I do agree with you Doug, that Pablo Marcos is not the best inker for him.
Doug: John Byrne is an artist who excels at both the lithe figures and those muscle-bound power guys. His pencils really have some depth in these issues. A stellar job!

Karen: The last page with Thor surrounded by Kirby Krackle, throwing his hammer straight at Nefaria, is a knock-out!

Avengers 164 - Count Me Deadly!

Avengers # 164 (Oct. 1977)
"To Fall By Treachery!"
writer: Jim Shooter
penciller: John Byrne
inker: Pablo Marcos

Karen: Welcome to the first of a three-part Avengers extravaganza! These issues - 164 through 166- show an Avengers team at both their worst and best. Despite a solid line-up of veterans, this team was having difficulty coming together, which would eventually lead to a serious confrontation between Captain America and Iron Man. But this very sense of disorder allowed for some excellent tales to be told.

Karen: This is old-style comics at their best: besides the main story, which involves Count Nefaria beefing up the powers of three has-been villains, Power Man, Whirlwind, and Living Laser, we get a ton of sub-plots that move the Avengers forward. We see the team's scientific minds trying to figure out how Wonder Man's body works, and the Beast feeling like a fifth wheel as they ignore his input; Wanda visits her 'father', the Whizzer; Cap expresses frustration with how the Avengers are operating; and Wonder Man shows a lack of confidence in battle. Shooter really gave the reader a lot of character moments - and a couple of great slug-fests, too!

Doug: This was indeed a fantastic issue. As we've said, with today's trend of decompression, this book was such a treat. Action, characterization, set-ups -- books like this take around 20 minutes to read! I really wish today's authors were made to take a course in writing based on the work of Lee, Thomas, Shooter, Englehart, Conway, etc.

Doug: I thought the way the Beast was ignored at the beginning of the story, when the scientific-types were doing the diagnostic work on Wonder Man that you mentioned, was an interesting plot twist. It had only been a few adventures ago (issue #140, actually) when the Beast had saved Hank Pym from basically exploding due to out-of-control growth. As Hank was now in the lab (along with T'Challa and Tony Stark), it seemed odd that he'd not acknowledge McCoy's biochemist-skills. T'Challa especially seemed to "big time" him. But this scene really paved the way for the fun-loving, free-wheeling Hank who'd later spend many an evening on the town with Wondy... that would be the Beast that I think many readers our age remember. So, for a lasting characterization, kudos to Shooter (even if it seemed odd at the time this transpired).

Karen: Count Nefaria is in pretty dire straits - he's so broke he can't even afford a chauffeur! But he's decided upon a plan of action that will change all that. The first part involves getting a ton of cash by having the 'Lethal Legion' (three bad guys is a Legion?) rob some banks. Unfortunately, despite a great line-up of Captain America, Black Panther, Yellowjacket, the Wasp, and Scarlet Witch, the Avengers are unable to catch stop the villains and they escape. Shooter makes it clear that the team is not firing on all cylinders, and this is bugging Cap. We'll see more of this in the issues to come.

Doug: You know what's cool about those three crooks? They're always nostalgiac when they show up, they really do have dangerous powers, but in the end you just know they're going to be had by the good guys! As we go through these old stories, the Silver Age mentality of having the good guys lose their heads, attack the baddies one-by-one, and get beat down does start to get a little tired. I mean, come on -- you have Captain America and the Black Panther around and everyone just jumps in without a plan? Same thing in the FF and the X-Men of this time. You'd think after all of that time spent training they'd have a maneuver for any possible nasty who might show up. But, I guess stories that finished in three pages wouldn't be any good, either.

Doug: I also really like the line-up here -- classic feel to it. Not the most powerful group ever, but a time-tested winner in many respects. Once Thor shows up in a couple of issues (sorry -- should have given a spoiler warning!), it'll really feel nice!

Karen: At the end of our tale, the three baddies decide to bring the action back to Avengers mansion, with Power Man announcing their arrival by throwing a car through a window! I love Beast's line here: "Couldn't find the bell, guys?"

Doug: I always liked the wise-cracking characters when I was a kid!

Karen: This time Wonder Man is with the team, and he flies off right after Power Man, only to get a fast fist to the gut. Wondy is stunned, not expecting his foe to be so powerful, and he freezes up in battle. I have to say, I really enjoyed what Shooter did with Wonder Man in this time period. Here's a guy almost as tough as Thor, yet he is plagued by self-doubt and fear. This was something quite different, and very interesting.

Doug: Wondy was played as that "man out of time" to a small extent, but you're right -- most of his issues stem from not knowing what he's made of and how his powers work (or don't work, as the case was from time-to-time). I think here in the first year or so of his revival, there was a lot of tinkering with him so far as how he'd fit in without duplicating what some of the other "power guys" did.

Karen: The fight goes on, when suddenly the villains find themselves so weak they cannot fight back. All of a sudden, the ground rumbles with a huge shockwave- Yellowjacket thinks, "Not even the Hulk could make one like this!" - and bursting from the ground is Nefaria, now wearing a costume, and proclaiming that he can now do anything, including killing the Avengers!

Doug: Yeah, definitely not looking good for our heroes!

Karen: What a fantastic issue. The pacing is great, we get a lot of nice character bits throughout, and Byrne's art is energetic. This is a real standout issue of Avengers, with the best yet to come!

Doug: This is shaping up to be a fun story! One comment about the art, though. You are spot on in your compliment of Byrne's pencils; I'd like to express that I've never warmed to the inks of Pablo Marcos. He's a bit heavy, and it's my feeling that books he worked on always tended to have a bit of a "muddy" feel to them. I know the printing techniques weren't as good then as they are now, but I just never cared for Marcos' work...